Einstein Disease (Aired 07-09-25 ) Caitlin McDonough on Authentic Influencer Marketing and AI

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome to Einstein's Disease. Through real world insights and powerful conversations with industry leaders, we help you break past limitations and rethink success. Are you ready to push the boundaries of what's possible? Hello, my name's Greg Ellers and I'm the host of Einstein's Disease. I am usually joined by my brilliant co host, Kenzie, but she's off today. We're here to explore the challenges of overconfidence, static thinking, and professional and personal growth. Our mission is to help individuals and businesses identify their blind spots, cultivate vulnerabilities and unlock the full potential. Get ready to challenge the status quo and discover the paths of success. Our guest today, Caitlin McDonough, knows all too well about the issues that are based in some element of Einstein's Disease. She's the founder and CEO of Fifth Wellness, a fitness, lifestyle and wellness brand that doubles as a full service agency for creators and companies that want real engagement, not empty likes. She's built a campaign for global names powered by data, the heart relentless gift that Caitlin brings to the show. And we welcome you here to Einstein's Disease. [00:01:19] Speaker B: Caitlin, thank you so much for having me today. [00:01:23] Speaker A: Yeah, it's, it's, it's great to connect. We met, what, I don't know, four or five months ago on happenstance and followed your business a bit and, and gotten some insight from you and it's great to have you on the show today. [00:01:37] Speaker B: I appreciate you having me and excited to chat further. [00:01:40] Speaker A: Absolutely. So in the first block, I think the most important thing is to level set a little bit. Tell, tell us what Fifth Wellness really is about what you're doing for your customers, for your clients and for the public as a whole because it's really exciting and there's a lot of challenges that have come from that and we'd like to start there with you, Caitlin. [00:02:08] Speaker B: Absolutely. So Fifth, we are a marketing, management and manufacturing agency based out of Boston, Mass. And we really kind of bring, you know, from industry insights and expertise, helping kind of both brands and creators and influencers kind of connect together and bring in real driven results, whether that be through the digital lens or through IRL activations. [00:02:33] Speaker A: And what is IRL activation? That's a bit, that's a big one for me. [00:02:39] Speaker B: So in real life, so anything kind of, it could be a campaign, any, it could be, you know, an event. It could, you know, be anything kind of a brand is kind of looking to activate within a space that really brings community in together. We really kind of key in on kind of experiential marketing that pairs with community driven results because, I mean, at the end of the day, it is the community and the consumer that really drives the brand. [00:03:07] Speaker A: Absolutely. And in, in building your business and engaging with not only your clients, but then obviously the CL clients addressable market, you've dealt with some pretty interesting challenges, haven't you, Caitlin, in terms of getting people across and converting clients to really see what, what a business like Fit Wellness can actually do. Talk to us a little bit about some of those challenges that you've experienced in building this wonderful company. [00:03:40] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. So I think a lot of the times, especially, you know, when you're in that kind of middle lane of navigating between brands and creators, you know, expectations are always, you know, fine lining what that means on both sides. You know, what does the expectation mean to the brand versus kind of in this influencer marketing new world that really is constantly evolving and changing what that lens really looks like for the creator and influencer and so kind of really bridging that gap and you know, taking, you know, the keys to the success and ROIs that the brand is looking for within their campaign and then, you know, who is that best fit? And you know, for influencers to understand that, you know, how they're building their brand and their success, you know, how they can pair that with the brand that they're partnering with to ensure that both parties are happy across the board. [00:04:37] Speaker A: So let, let's talk about that. Happy, because we, from the outside, you experience or see influencers and they have tens of millions of followers, but not everybody else does. Right. And some of those large influencers might not even be the best match for some of the clients that you've got. Right. So talk to us a little bit about that challenge of Matt. It's almost a matchmaking in a way, isn't it, Caitlin? I mean, that's your, that's your secret sauce. [00:05:12] Speaker B: It really is. It's very matchmaking and it's kind of, you know, we'll sit down with a brand and we'll say, you know, kind of, you know, what are you looking for? You know, are you looking for brand awareness and visibility? Are you looking for conversions? You know, are you look, where are you looking for this campaign to drive? Who is the target audience? You know, a lot of the times you don't know, just going onto a creator's page, who their target audience is. You don't know who follows them, what that demographic is, Is it how percentage is male versus female, what the age range, demographic. So if you're a brand that is trying to cater to a, you know, all women's female base between 25 and 34. But you partner with a creator whose target audience of who follows them is majority, you know, male between, you know, 18 and 26. Well, that campaign's not going to be successful because you didn't kind of dive into making sure and aligning that who you're partnering with, their target audience is also your target audience. And it's definitely a huge mistake I see a lot of brands make because you know, they're like this creator looks great. You know, they have high, a high following rate. They, their aesthetics are on brand for what we're looking for. We love their storytelling capabilities, you know, the way they create content. But sometimes then it's going even further to ask for those key insights of, you know, does their key insights match with our key insights? [00:06:44] Speaker A: Absolutely. So what you described there is you're sitting with me, your potential or your client. And I've said I really want Lucy or Steve to be my influencer. And you're like, well, Lucy's just not going to do it because that's not your market. You might like what she does. And so you're challenged to, to get that customer, your client to basically go to or understand why you're looking at that. But they can be blocked in that and not really believe. And you run into situations where they're like, well, we don't really care, Caitlin. We really want Lucy to be our influencer. [00:07:21] Speaker B: Right. And I think just kind of laying all the cards on the table, especially to the brand of and we recently had a campaign like this where they only wanted to work with, you know, creators and influencers who had over 100,000 followers. And kind of the ones that we were kind of combing through didn't have as strong as of engagement as some of the other creators that were up for consideration that had less than 100,000 followers but were reaching, you know, 5 to 6 million individuals per 30 day period. And so it's kind of walking the brand through. Yes, I understand that that following number that you're seeing at the very top of the page is not as high as these creators. However, in a 30 day period they are triple reaching triple the number of individuals that the creators over 100,000 weren't reaching. And it's always for very different reasons. And then kind of breaking it down as to well, why is that and who are they reaching and then circling it back to showing them how that can actually deliver them what they are looking for in this campaign versus just picking the creator who might have the highest following. [00:08:41] Speaker A: So it sounds like one of your challenges with clients can be they look at that follower number because it's at the top. [00:08:50] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:08:51] Speaker A: And it's the easiest one to understand. It's the easiest one to understand. [00:08:55] Speaker B: Yeah. No, and we always encourage, even when the representation side of creators, when a brand would reach out to us, we always send those key metric insights that you can't see that's in their professional dashboard. We keep those updated, we include them in all the media kits just for transparency across the board of, you know, hey, this is what 30, their 30 day most recent insights look like we can give you 90. It just, I think it's being super transparent is so important, especially in this industry as it just kind of takes away from any miscommunication or, you know, overthinking that oh, I know what they're looking for, even though I didn't ask. And vice versa, from the brand side of, oh, I, I know this influencer is going to deliver me X, Y and Z. But never really diving into the behind the scenes of who follows them, why they follow them, who their target audience is and other kind of key insights like that. [00:09:53] Speaker A: No, for sure. So on the other side, if we, if we go to the other side and I'm the influencer, which I'm not, but let's just say that I am and I'm like Caitlin, I really want that brand, I would be good for this. You have people that, people that are reaching out to you that are influencers that you work with and you have to work with them as well to manage their expectations and what they're really good at. Because ideally you want them to make the most amount of revenue when you set them up for a campaign, not to have one that falls flat for both parties. Right. I mean that's gotta be a big challenge too. It's kind of a new ego market in a sense, isn't it? [00:10:37] Speaker B: It is and it's. And I always say every brand is different and not every brand works within the same marketing budget. And also from the creator and influencer side, there's this responsibility to their community. You know, it's. Social media has evolved so much where the consumer understands they are getting paid, they understand that and they know that. And so that then barriers a level of trust where either they know you're getting paid, but they also know that you're authentic and you're not going to just promote something to promote something with a brand. To take a paycheck. However, if you are just kind of searching for the paychecks and you're promoting everything, your community knows that and that really will affect long term who's following you and kind of your key insights, which is just going to kind of downfall long term sustainability within the influencer space because you're going to lose the trust within your community. And once you lose that trust within your community, you're not going to be as appealing to a brand because at the end of the day, that is what they're looking for. And we're even seeing that developing even further with kind of how these influencer marketing campaigns are work from where we were three years ago, where brands are really looking for authenticity with a creator of using their products or believing in their company prior to even contacting them. And so a lot of the times they'll go back, you know, six months to a year to see like, have they even mentioned, have they tried my product? Have they, you know, is this something that they actually believe in or are they just trying to work with us because they want us to pay them? So and it really, it values too, like for some creators who have built such a strong, large platform, well, you know, they may have the upper hand on the brand because you know, they are, you know, the IT creator at the moment. And so at that point it's kind of the brand is going to side with what the creator wants. But if you're in that kind of micro macro space and it's a very saturated market now and you're competing against so many people, it's what makes you stand out against all these other creators who are in the same kind of space as you are creating similar content. You know, why should you be the one that is picked? And that's a big thing we work with our creators on is building their brands so that when we get into a meeting to pitch them and you know, we have their creative concepts, we have kind of everything that they have going on throughout the year of ways in which a longer term partnership could exist with a brand. We're able to present their full calendar to the brand and it really then allows the brand to see, okay, like they take themselves very seriously and they view themselves as a brand as well. And I can see a multitude of ways of how this relationship works on both ends. [00:13:43] Speaker A: That's been that that is a great way to share that because very clear and very understandable for the layman, especially a person like me. With that we're going to cut away to One of our sponsors. I don't know if they're using one of your influencers, but maybe when we watch the show, you'll tell me. Listen, we'll be right back after these commercial messages. We're with Caitlin McDonough, CEO of Fifth Wellness. Thank you, Caitlin. We'll see you shortly. Hi, this is Greg Ellers, host of Einstein's Disease. Are you loving what you're watching? Don't miss a moment of Einstein's Disease or any of your other favorite NOW Media TV shows. Live or on demand, anytime, anywhere. Download the Now Media TV app on Roku iOS. Enjoy instant access to our full lineup of bilingual programs in both English and Spanish. Prefer to listen on the Go catch the podcast version of the show right now on the NOW Media TV website. NOW Media TV for business and breaking news to lifestyle, culture and everything in between. Now Media TV is streaming 247 ready whenever you are. This is Greg Ellers, host of Einstein's Disease. And I'm happy to be back with our guest today, Caitlin McDonough, CEO of Fit Wellness. We were breaking down in the first segment, Caitlin, some of the, the challenges, some of the, the areas where you have to break through and either help your, your clients or your influencers understand that there's maybe a different path and that path leads to better success. And we're going to talk about that in this segment. And as, as I mentioned to you off camera, what you mentioned with respect to your clients and the desire to have a shiny object be that person that's a spokesperson for the company versus that other object that actually is going to have a higher conversion or more authentic to your brand. That's a. So you've had to deal with that challenge. We talked about that. But talk to us a little bit about some of the solutions or ways you've found for your company not only to thrive, but to continue to get that strong reputation that you have in this industry, especially in the New England area. [00:16:06] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. So one of the biggest things when we kind of go in with that is, you know, what's the best first move within that solution. So if we come to kind of a roadblock where, you know, a brand is really wanting one specific person and, you know, we're trying to kind of walk through with them why they may not be the best fit for this particular campaign, we'll kind of dive deep into kind of a solution framework with them of showing and breaking down, you know, those specific ROIs that are looking to be achieved and then taking kind of the key Insights within, you know, if we're down, if we were narrowed down to two specific creators and influencer marketing, you know, their key insights, proof of concepts from other kind of campaigns that they have done in the past and then really aligning it down to showing in kind of just like a very clear format of why and what most likely will unfold in that campaign if we go, you know, route A with this creator versus if we go route B with this creator. And that has really helped brands to kind of as we're kind of diving through and we kind of create like a little deck for them of like what we're thinking based off of proof of concepts that we've seen in the past with this creator based off of, you know, similar concepts, you know, our camp that campaign may have versus one they've done in the past, geared with the target audience, you know, that each creator has and the key insights that they've pulled both within the last 30 days as well as in the last 90 days, because I think so especially from the brand side in any influencer marketing, that's a really. Those two key pieces of insights are really important to look at because you're able to see in real time what that their community has done in the last month as well as in the last three months and kind of that most likely is going to in a way unfold either a little more increase or a little more decrease within the following month. [00:18:12] Speaker A: No, it makes sense. So on. On that the. On your client side. [00:18:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:18:20] Speaker A: In the industry, things have changed dramatically. You mentioned in the first segment how fast this industry has either matured or, you know, gone. At least we're in some inning beyond infancy. We're somewhere. We don't know where it's actually going to go. So the metrics and the way that you measure things, you, you identified initially the top line. Everybody looks at followers and that doesn't matter. But talk to us a little bit about overcoming that data solution in the sense that I just gave you X amount of money for a campaign and this was the expectation. I went with the person that you had. I've got some element of conversion in that. Talk to us how you work through that educational process. Because this is new stuff to a lot of people. I've got a great company or your clients have great companies and all of a sudden we're using a different medium or a different channel to make people aware of our brand. So there's something that you've. You. There's a sense of education, but there's also A sense that everybody in your industry, it doesn't actually look at measurement the same way. How, how do you go about that with your clients? Because that's got to be a challenge. Because they're looking at it. They might say, well, I only sold six widgets and I spent $500. That's not a very good deal. But you have to work through that. [00:19:45] Speaker B: Yeah. And it's, it's also time too. Like, again, it's, we've really unfolded in the social media world since, you know, social media really hit back in kind of the early 2000s. And I even say, like, I'll say to brands, you know, look at the way from the creator and influencer space, I mean, it, that's evolved dramatically in the last 10 years of before it used to be, you know, there was no storyline, there was no creative concept. There was really nothing behind it. It was just, you would see people who either had a large following or in the celebrity world that they'd post, they'd hold the product, they'd smile, and that was really it. And that was really selling for companies. Like, all they needed to do was get their product in the hands of the right person and have them pose in a photograph and it would sell. And that just doesn't work anymore. Like, it just is not like that. You really need to be effective storytelling across the board. And a lot of times what we see do really well is that organic product placement where you can't even tell that reel or that video was an ad. And it just is really diving into that creator of kind of who they are organically and kind of how they've grown. So what we really saw with those Get Ready With Me videos, there's so many ads that are in Get Ready With Me videos that the consumer doesn't really know. But, but they are loving the way that it's either being styled or used in the video, and then they're immediately buying it. And that's what we're really seeing in today's world as being super effective is, you know, just these very organic storytelling pieces of content that connects with the consumer in a real and authentic way, but also organically pushes, you know, the brand's product that they're looking to convert. [00:21:47] Speaker A: No, that's, that, that's really interesting because you, you touched on something I, I, I want to move over to, which is, and we, we talked about this through the process. I could stand there and say, I hold a product and it would sell and the, and the, the company was happy and people Then started doing five, six, ten different things, and they got diluted, as you said, or it's not authentic. So you have to help some of these influencers that do have a following and authentic people, but they just participated as the industry grew. It wasn't their fault that they did 25 things because you had 25 clients that wanted to book that person. So it worked. It's just a change. And it probably has a lot to do with the fact that the generations for which a lot of people target the 18 to 35 or 18 to 34, whatever it is, you're a lot more suspicious of things because you grew up in this environment. You're like, that's not real. That person doesn't really like this. Whereas people of my generation or below me, we really never identified to that influencer market. We just saw it as advertising. So you've got these influencers or content creators that were successful, and now you've got to rebrand them in some sense, because they still have a following. They're great people, they can tell good stories, but they've got to diminish the amount of people that they're campaigning for because it doesn't look authentic. How do you go about that with somebody that was a big star and help bring them back down to saying, you know what, we're just going to do coke and Rice Krispies, you know, I mean, not really, but I'm just trying to, you know, where they used to do everything. [00:23:38] Speaker B: Yeah. So I always say a rebrand is not a bad thing. And especially kind of as your brand has evolved throughout the years. You know, and specifically in the example we're using here, it's. And we've had this happen with, you know, a few clients of ours who, you know, were athletes at the time, specifically, like in the CrossFit space. So, you know, they might have gained a lot of their following from being a CrossFit athlete. And that's, you know, really how, you know, the number that reflects on the page that's, you know, as when you're coming in. You don't know when did they grow that following? When did that number get to there? How long have they, you know, sat at that following? A lot of brands don't know those answers. They just know I really like what they're doing. They're resonating with my brand. And so when we have, like, a creator who will start working with, who's like, hey, I have this great following. Had it for around five, six years kind of now, like, I've transitioned, I've evolved. I'm in a new space. I kind of want to rebrand, to be able to both connect to the audience and community have grown, but also gain in additional followers as well. That kind of now meets me where I am at in my life. And so we really, like, sit and dive deep into kind of their brands. And it's like, okay, like, what. What am I getting if I come to your page? Why would I want to hit the follow button? Or why would I want to hit the. Like, what is going to compel me? And you know what, that also always goes back to you asking yourself the question when you're scrolling, why do you stop and watch a video? Or why do you stop to like something? Or why do you stop to comment? Like, what is it inside of you that compels you to kind of initiate those kind of key metrics? It's very similar to what's initiating everyone else to do the same. So when you really ask yourself that question, then you're able to kind of unfold a better strategy and better storytelling components and kind of strategic concepts. Because people want, you know, information, I would say, especially the younger generation, like, they're. They are compelled to kind of want to dive deeper into understanding individuals where kind of a different generation. It was kind of quick, like, they didn't kind of care so much to kind of learn and unfold people's stories. But what we've even seen with, you know, reality TV shows, people get really connected to people and they feel like they know them, they feel like they understand them. And so that they then now are invested. And once you get somebody invested in you and invested in your story and invested in your life, they want to know all. All areas and all components. And they. And they follow it religiously, especially the younger generation. And so kind of that's the same key I will take with creators. Like, yep, maybe you weren't on a reality TV show, but how you're creating your content is similar in which we want people to be invested in you and we want people to care about all aspects of your. And there's a level of privacy. We always tell people, like, you don't want people involved in every aspect of your life. So what are you willing and wanting to show? And then how do we create impactful stories and creative concepts off of those key concepts that they're willing to share? [00:27:03] Speaker A: That is outstanding, Caitlin. The solutions for your clients in the educational process, the solutions for rebranding, those are the challenges that we're going to continue to face going forward that we're going to talk about in the next segment, which is a big challenge for you, which is the advent and the explosion of AI in the influencer space. But with that, we're going to cut away for our pay for this show and hear from our sponsors. It's Greg Ellers, host of Einstein's disease with Caitlin McDonough, CEO of Fit Wellness. And we'll be back shortly. Thank you. Caitlin. Hi, this is Greg Ellers. Are you loving what you're watching? Don't miss a minute of Einstein's Disease or any of your other favorite shows on Now Media. Get to the Now Media app that's free on Roku iOS. Enjoy instant access to our full lineup of bilingual programs in both English and Spanish. Prefer to listen on the Grow. Catch the podcast version of our show right on the Now Media TV website at NowMedia TV. From business breaking news to lifestyle culture and everything else in between, now Media TV is streaming 247 ready whenever you are. I'm back with Caitlin McDonough, CEO of Fit Wellness. Caitlin, I really enjoyed, and I know our audience is enjoying how well you're able to lay out not only the problems that we discussed in the first segment, but the solutions not only for your clients but, but, but also your influencers and the people that are, are helping these clients of yours get the message out for their product. But in this next segment, we're going to kind of dive into a little bit of the disruption that you and I have talked about off camera and in previous conversations. And that is AI, it is driving a lot of different ways that people are receiving information. You mentioned, you know, when somebody is you looking at a reel or a story on social media, what is it that forces them to like it? What is it forcing them to comment about it? Well, some of those now are AI generated and not real. Right. And some people may appreciate them. Some people get hoodwinked by them, meaning they believe that they're real. You're facing that challenge in your industry because AI in many ways can potentially provide those aha moments that the insurance industry has seen for the last few years. We watch a progressive commercial and you just scratch your head and it causes you to laugh. Well, AI can maybe help create some of those same things in a different way, but you're dealing with it on a day to day basis because you've watched this industry grow, Caitlin, from different elements as you've talked about, where people just stand there, hold up a product and it sells and they were really the advent of the influencer in some sense. Tell us what you're thinking about AI right now and how you're seeing it both as a tool and also as a challenge for all parts of your industry. [00:30:35] Speaker B: Yeah, I think the evolution AI has been super interesting and I'm definitely interested to see kind of where it evolves to especially in the world of kind of marketing and kind of influencer marketing. I think it's been a phenomenal and powerful tool from content ideation and kind of enhancing storytelling or creative concepts or kind of giving you different ideas that you might not have originally like thought of off of like a concept or theme you kind of had built in in regards to kind of the video creation that we're seeing across the board where, you know, it's very AI generated. I think a lot of the times right now in where we're sitting today, consumers can tell like you can like kind of tell and point out right away that that was an AI generated video and it's not as well received. I think it kind of, that circles back to the same unauthentic elements that, you know, we've disassociated from when influencer marketing really started where it was that holding a product. And it didn't really take a lot of creativity in that space as it does today. And so I think what AI is missing right now is kind of again that really connection within an individual. And you can't use the likeness of someone's image in an AI generated video unless they've given you permission. And so I think that's a key component we're going to miss especially in influencer marketing space is, you know, it's not, it still doesn't feel authentic when trying to use an AI video in a campaign with an influencer or creator that you're trying to kind of partner with. So it's, I think it's great for building ideas or kind of getting concepts on themes, but I don't think, you know, using it to create the storytelling elements in the video aspects of it. I don't think we're there yet and we may get there, but I think you might more see that in the UGC space if you know, a brand has come in and has access to raw footage or content that has already been created and then they can take it in, make multitudes of videos off of a few images that they've received on the back end. [00:33:13] Speaker A: No, that makes sense. The one thing that you touched on there, and I would think that it would get a lot of Backlashes that if I was a major influencer and I gave my name and likeness to AI and people found out about it, they would probably, in today's day and age, I think it would go what they call viral on the Internet that you've sold yourself, you've sold your sold soldier soul because people work so hard, as you discussed, as one of the primary challenges when we talked about this is authenticity. [00:33:56] Speaker B: Yeah, well, and I mean, even from that end, it wouldn't even be smart for a creator to do that because they'd be devaluing, you know, what they would be able to kind of build their brand to monetarily. I mean, even from the UGC space, like with our creators, if a brand is looking to use the likeness of their image or content that they have, you know, created for the brand, that they're not necessarily posting like they're still receiving payment for the image that is being pushed out for them. And so, you know, I think it would be detrimental, especially to a creator to hand over the rights to their image to AI because it would essentially take them out of business. [00:34:40] Speaker A: Yeah, no, for sure. One of the areas I want to touch on and it's. And it's really want your thought on this. So much of the target audience that is anywhere from teenage years to 35, have really only grown up with a high level of technology and information that's come from a smartphone or come from elements that have primarily focused on that demographic for consumption, whether it's for girls or boys at a young age, for sports or makeup or beauty, whatever it might be. It's. It has been extremely successful and your industry has seen a lot of people that have been able to be very successful and create not only their brand, but enhance the companies that they represent because it's work. Right. But so many of those people really have never had a lot of engagement outside of social media like other generations did. So the question that I have in this is, do you see or feel there's a new lane opening not only because of AI, because you kind of question, is that real or not real? And the demand for people to be authentic and it goes viral, if they find out that they're a hypocrite, that there's a wider lane that's coming here for true humans to engage in that sense, because there's like everything else, we get to a point where people are like, oh, that's just not real. I don't find it. And it gives you a whole new angle and a whole new channel when you're working with some of your, some of your clients. [00:36:31] Speaker B: No, absolutely. And I think it's, it's a great point because a big piece especially I would say with the generation who has just fully grown up with social media being present in their life since you know, they can remember, we've really lost what we've seen with individuals is the ability to connect with community in real life. And so that's an, a big thing like we've seen where I will have some of my creators who could talk to their phones all day long, no issue. But if I bring them into a setting that you know, they have to do public speaking or they have to network in person, you know. Well, some people will be like oh wow, they're so different in person because they're just used to how, you know, extroverted they are online. And I think it's a huge barrier we've seen especially in the younger creator generation where they are super extroverted digitally but super introverted in real life. And so it's kind of, I really think it's important to be able to be both because going back to the authenticity pieces, you know, what people see online, unfortunately that's what they think they're always going to get in real life. And in some ways you kind of want that to match but also respecting that, you know, some people are a bit different in what they show you versus kind of who they are as a real person and bringing in AI, I think that's just going to kind of add to that and area that we've seen and you know, it could lead to more introvert or it could really push people out of their shell and really allow for kind of that more extroverting IRL components to really kind of connect with community because really I think that's what it's all about. [00:38:34] Speaker A: No, I, I, I'm optimistic that it's the latter where people come out of your, their shell. The one point you made there about people public speaking versus talking into their phone or however they're user generated content. It's the privacy issue that you mentioned in the first segment. What how much of your real life do you really want to give up? And when you're asking people to do something out of what is their profession, either those skills atrophied Caitlyn, or they never existed. Especially if they're younger. Right? A lot of those younger people, they couldn't have a public speaking conversation to start. They can't look you in the eye. It's not because they weren't capable. They just never learned those skills. [00:39:23] Speaker B: Yeah. Because they've just grown up with it being them and their phone. [00:39:27] Speaker A: Exactly. [00:39:28] Speaker B: And so I think that. I think it's important to have both and be able to do both, because it's just another layer in which you can connect to people. And at the end of the day, that's really what it's all about, connecting. [00:39:41] Speaker A: With people, which we've been doing on Einstein's disease with Caitlin McDonough, the CEO of Fit Wellness. We're going to take a break and we're going to come back and learn about Caitlin and what's next for her. And with that, we'll be back shortly. Thank you. Hi, this is Greg Ellers, host of Einstein's Disease, and we've had a great show today. I've had the fortune of having Caitlin McDonough, the CEO of Fit Wellness, on today. Caitlin, it's really prescient to today's day and time being able to have a guest like you on because you touch so many different elements from people that are aspiring to where is my career going to go? What am I going to do? I'm really interested in a lot of the social aspects of social media, and you've been able to provide a lens to some people on that, which we really appreciate. But in this last segment, we. We really want to give the audience the ability to get into what you called some of your privacy. Who is Caitlin? How did she get into this? What's next for Caitlin? You know, if you could share a little bit of that with us, we greatly appreciate it, and we know that it's actually you. [00:40:53] Speaker B: Absolutely. So I started kind of this journey about 10 years ago. Originally, kind of coming out of high school, I wasn't quite sure what I wanted to do. I actually thought I wanted to kind of go in an early education route. And so I actually deferred from college just to kind of give myself some time to figure out exactly what it was that I wanted to do. I ended up landing an opportunity, you know, kind of during that time with Reebok, with a position in kind of their fitness department at their headquarters. And kind of got in there and was really able to kind of just see how this global corporate company was working in a multitude of ways, both across a wide range of departments. And one of the big things I had noticed was there was really no kind of local activation within where headquarters was sitting was Boston in. And so one of the roles I had in that job, I had landed with them was to kind of, you know, bring community and build brand awareness within local activation for the company. And so I just kind of started partnering with different like studios and instructors at the time in the fitness space to kind of build out that residency and through a few events out of headquarters gym that had made our headquarters store quite a bit of money in a two hour period that the store had like never seen. And so that kind of then resulted in, I was able to connect with other departments in the kind of the upstairs corporate space and landed a opportunity in the PR communications department working cross functionally within brand management and brand marketing. And kind of through there, you know, saw a different lens working on the global side of the brand and how we were working with different agencies. And then through my time there I ended up kind of deciding I really wanted to be an entrepreneur and I really wanted to own my own agency. And all the agencies we were working with were phenomenal. But no one really understood the fitness, wellness and lifestyle industries as a full component. And I could never find an agency that specializes especially in fitness and wellness. And as a fitness and wellness brand, the campaigns we were activating like they were so specific to those communities. And so at the time Reebok was going through a divestorship where they were being acquired by another organization. And I kind of just thought it would be the perfect time to walk away. And so we had a couple upcoming kind of global campaigns that I knew they wanted like a local activation build out for. And so I basically, you know, presented a idea to one of the teams we were working with of like if I created an agency, would they hire that agency to lead that upcoming campaign for the local activation? And they were like yeah, 100%. And so I made the decision to leave. That was our first big event at fifth as we did a full huge global campaign that was built out of the headquarters gym space for that kind of to bring in the local activation components. And then from there I was out of my non compete. So I started to kind of be able to work cross functionally with other fitness and wellness brands and we brought in creators and it kind of just all like bloomed from there. And then. [00:44:46] Speaker A: That's a great story. You what? So you made this decision. [00:44:50] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:44:51] Speaker A: And you, you got a yes. You got Reebok to yes in terms of you being able and you clearly, I think a big kudos to you. The fitness element to life has only continued to grow and expand. And you saw that, you saw a big green field where there wasn't anyone and that in and of itself was a big identification for yourself to be able to create a brand, to be able to create a company. So I think that's, that, that is something I it that everybody doesn't have because a lot of times you start a business and you fail, right? Or you have some real challenges. When you, when you were ready to go out on your own, who did you call and say, hey, I'm, I'm gonna go do this. Did you, did you call your folks? Did you have a friend? I mean, because, I mean it's a big decision. You just don't make it in a capsule like that. [00:45:45] Speaker B: No, it was. So my parents always taught me, you know, you don't leave a job until you get another job. And so that has always been super ingrained in me. And so I, you know, was kind of putting pieces in place and even like I created the agency and I launched the agency and I built our website while all, while I was still working at Reebok and kind of figuring out, okay, you know, what does this look like? So, you know, when I did present the opportunity, I wasn't presenting a company that didn't exist. And so kind of was really working two full time jobs, just you know, my nine to five there and then basically all night, all early hours of the morning, kind of getting fifth ready to where I, I thought it needed to be. And you know, when I did make that offer and pitch, you know, it, I was able to kind of say, hey, we have revenue coming in and so I'm going to leave. And this is kind of my business plan and operations for what this will look like. And I think, you know, at one point everyone was like, what are you doing? Because it's like, you know, corporate America. It's comfortable, it's salary, it's benefits. And when you work for yourself, you work for yourself. And it's a grind and it's a hustle and you know, the one thing I've always said, and I think that stands as far I will outwork anybody, I will, I will do whatever it takes to get the job done. And I care about all of our clients brands as if they are my own. And so the same dedication and passion that I put into my agency, if you are our client, it's the same dedication and passion I will put into your brand. [00:47:42] Speaker A: That is, that's the close that I bet you say a lot when you're in those meetings because there's a lot of passion behind that. That's really good. In our, in our closing minute Here, advice for young aspiring entrepreneurs. What would you. You already said it's you, you have to have a plan. And you, you demonstrated that. But what, what would you. If you could give them just one piece of advice, what would it be, Caitlin? [00:48:10] Speaker B: So just do it. Like, you may fail, it may be successful, it may not be maybe the best idea at this moment. And it may be a piece to your idea and, you know, through your journey and through your story, you'll develop others. But I think the risk to fail scares so many people. But I mean, at the end of the day, if it something didn't work out, you can pivot, you can rebrand, you can, you know, create something new. It's. If you're willing to just put the hard work in and you're willing to just do whatever it takes to just really kind of create what you want, you will find success. [00:48:54] Speaker A: And overcome Einstein's disease, because it definitely is there whenever you start a business. Caitlin, I really want to thank you for being a guest on our show this week. It's been a, it's been a pleasure to have you. I look forward to my next journey to Boston. Maybe we'll, we'll actually meet in person because you're, you've got a great, a great business, and I want to see more great stories out of you and I, as does our audience. So I really appreciate you being here today and look forward to seeing that next chapter in Fifth Wellness and in Kayla McDonough's life. Thank you very much. [00:49:29] Speaker B: Thank you for having me.